Bridging the Communication Gap in HVAC: Lessons from Jonathan Neves

Ever wondered how green technology can revolutionize the HVAC industry? Join us on the Successful Life Podcast as we chat with Jonathan Neves, founder of Green Energy Mechanical, about his transformative journey from a teen in the trades to a pioneering business owner in Boston. Discover how Jonathan's passion for energy-efficient solutions has not only set his company apart as an industry leader but also empowered him to mentor his team and others, sharing the crucial skills of listening and emotional intelligence in sales.

Communication is key in HVAC, and Jonathan's insights are invaluable. We'll uncover the role of salespeople as consultants, delving into the importance of proper equipment sizing and tackling outdated electrical infrastructures. This episode also shines a spotlight on workforce development initiatives aimed at underprivileged and minority communities, illustrating how HVAC careers can be life-changing, especially for those from challenging backgrounds. Through personal stories, we see how mastering communication can bridge the gap between where you are and where you want to be, both financially and professionally.

Finally, we break down effective sales techniques and strategies, drawing inspiration from Chris Voss's "Never Split the Difference." Learn the art of asking probing questions to uncover customer motivations and objections and the importance of being fully present during interactions. We'll explore real-life scenarios demonstrating how to handle price objections and emphasize the power of positive reviews and reputation. Jonathan's dedication to ethical sales and leadership, combined with the value of transparency and trust, rounds out this enriching episode. Don’t miss out on these valuable insights that can elevate your HVAC business to new heights!

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Chapters

• 0:56 Success in Green Energy Industry
• 7:50 Importance of Communication Skills in HVAC
• 22:02 Effective Sales Techniques and Strategies
• 28:22 Effective Sales Strategies for Success
• 41:43 Sales Strategies in Air Purification
• 54:41 Sales Conversation Insights and Strategies
• 1:07:23 Ethical Sales and Leadership Discussions
• 1:11:21 Power of Positive Reviews in Business

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:57

Welcome to the Successful Life Podcast. I'm your host, corey Barrier, and I'm here with my main. I almost called you, jeremy man. I messed most people's last name up Jonathan Knees. What's up, brother? What's up, man?

Speaker 2: 1:09

How's it going? I'm doing good, man. Thanks for taking the time and inviting me on, man.

Speaker 1: 1:15

Yeah, dude. So I just want to set the stage here before we dive in, and I want to get into this. But we connected through. You know, we both know Sam Wakefield, and you know you had commented on a guy's post the other day and I can't remember the question, but the answer that you gave about how you know gave, about how you tie emotion to the sale and you actively listen I think it was in there and you just laid it out exactly how I would have laid it out myself, and so I just feel like there's a lot of that that's missing in the trades, and I think a lot of people just could be so much more successful if they just embodied the things that you talked about, the things I believe. And before we get into that, though, let's give everybody a little bit of idea who you are, what all you do, and just a little background man.

Speaker 2: 2:15

For sure, for sure. So, yeah, I started in this field when I was a teenager and went to a what is it a tech school? Tech high school Started working in the trades as a teenager, so when I came out, I went right into the field. At 27, I started this company and I really wanted to focus it on greener technology. You know, we're in the Boston Massachusetts area, so back in 2011, nobody was really talking about energy efficient solutions and it kind of made me think I'm like I might be a little bit ahead of the curve. Instead of calling it Jonathan heating there, I was like you know what let's do green energy man. And so it's been good now, because now there's been this huge push for greener solutions and they want to put a lot of cold climate heat pumps in homes, and so we've built up a lot of authority because we've been around a lot longer than some of the new players around that are jumping into it. And then there's a lot of plumbers and oil companies that are jumping in the mix. So that's been helpful.

Speaker 2: 3:19

And yeah, man, you know my focus now is just growing, my company expanding, and you know I have a big passion for business and for sales in particular. I love the psychology behind it, the science behind it. I get such a rush when you know you could take like the most difficult customer and they're just like, all right, man, let's move forward. And you're like, let's go. So like, um, my big flex now is I just love helping my uh, some of the guys that work for me. Come up and seeing them doing the same things and they'll. They'll come back like yo, jay, we just had that meeting last week. You won't believe it. Like the stuff you told me work like the first call. So it's cool, man, so that's. And now even the same thing, even around the country, like I'll talk to people for hours. You know, sometimes it'd be driving my wife nuts Cause I'll be on the phone to like 10 o'clock at night.

Speaker 2: 4:10

And one of the dudes asked me the other day he's like yo, like do you have like a training or a class or anything like that? I'm like, nah, man. He's like you're just doing this because I'm like. You know why, man? Because this industry is phenomenal. There's so many people that have taken me under their wing. There are people that still do take me under their wing, so it would just only be right for me to pass that along. You know what I mean. So that's where we're at now. My company, like I said, started 13 years ago. This year we should do probably just shy of 12 million, I think. So not some big, huge company, but not a small player either. I think you know we're in a good spot and having fun doing it, man.

Speaker 1: 4:51

That's amazing. Yeah, dude, there's a lot, of, a lot of people don't want to pay it forward, and I just think it's the wrong recipe. You know what I mean? Because it all comes back. I mean, I'm in recovery and I have people that I help and would never in a million years charge a dollar for and, dude, there's no better feeling than to be able to help somebody that needs it and wants it and is actually going to use it. And so, yeah, I get, I get, yeah, I totally get that. So, um, you do multiple things, though, right, you don't, you aren't. You don't you do solar, and do you do solar?

Speaker 1: 5:33

we don't know I don't know why I thought that. I guess because it said green energy.

Speaker 2: 5:36

Maybe I just assumed it's funny because we're actually rebranding with Dan Antonelli right now. So he's like why haven't you dropped the name, why haven't you dropped the brand yet? Because we get that a lot.

Speaker 1: 5:46

So Dude, you know I've heard nothing. I've had Dan on the show. I like Dan. I like Dan a lot, I think. I mean he's got, he's got, you know, whenever he puts a brand out, like it does make a difference. And look, I was just talking to my dad the other day about this and he lives in a smaller town and you know he's 70-some years old and it's like you know, these guys ride around in their big trucks, all these logos and shit on them and they're fancy outfits and I'm like, dude, like like you got to think about the employees, like when they suit up and show up and get in that van, like it's a different experience for them.

Speaker 2: 6:29

Yep.

Speaker 1: 6:30

And that means it's a different experience for the customer period, you got it.

Speaker 2: 6:35

That's actually a motto at Green Energy. You know it's win, win, win. So you know, know, when our guys win, they're gonna feel amazing. They make sure our customers win, they're gonna give the most badass experience possible. And then green energy wins because you know, customer pays their bills and, uh, hopefully leaves us a great review and gives us referrals. You know, so it just goes full circle. So you're 100, right man yeah, dude, you were.

Speaker 1: 6:59

You were definitely ahead of the curve on the green energy thing. I mean, it's the whole. Everything's really played out seems like in your favor. That, by and large. I mean it's really been a big push from the government side for sure. So I do have to ask or what, um, what kind of systems do you guys? Are you one brand or multiple brand, or no, it really depends.

Speaker 2: 7:23

So in Massachusetts we have like a really old portfolio of homes that are here. It's very different than the rest of the country where the rest of the country might have a bunch of row houses or, you know, homes that are built Like. People will say like oh, the homes are real old over here, I'm like how old From the seventies, dude. Oh, the homes are real old over here, I'm like how old From the 70s, dude, our homes are like 1910 and it's wild. And so it really just depends on the application. So it requires our salespeople to really be consultants. They really have to go in, do a full manual, j you know, because if you put a heat pump in, for instance, that's way too big for the home, it's obviously going to have problems, right. And same thing on the other side if it's too small, it's not going to keep up and so really getting that correct is a big deal. And then the other side, the other problem is the electrical is very old, the infrastructure. So you have these homes that are putting in EV car stations and you know heat pump, electric hybrid hot water heaters and then obviously heat pumps for the home, and they're trying to run it all on a 60 amp panel. That's a recipe for disaster. So there's been a lot of big push and need for a lot of electrical upgrades as well. So it's been, it's been cool, it's been interesting and again, because we have the authority, it's been.

Speaker 2: 8:46

I mean, I've got to meet with the secretary of the Department of Energy before they came out with inflation reduction react because of the stuff we're doing in Massachusetts, the stuff we're doing at Green Energy, where she wanted somebody, secretary Granholm, she wanted to have like somebody on the front lines doing these things every single day. So who better than Green Energy? Right, is a lot of workforce development, where I'm really trying to help bring programs and these different programs to people that get second chances, that come out of jail and are trying to turn their life around, as well as a lot of minorities in different school systems, underprivileged areas. So I do a lot of speaking engagements at, like, high schools, trade schools, second chance organizations and then, like I said, really working with it's called the Massachusetts Clean Energy or Center for Clean Energy and the MassCEC and helping with their workforce development.

Speaker 2: 9:51

So again, that's kind of like the pay it forward on the other side too, right, like I know it's probably getting a little off topic, but when I was growing up I didn't grow up in the best areas and I could really kind of see where my life was heading if I stayed going that way. And so HVAC was definitely like my ticket to just make the right choices and don't go down a certain path. A lot of my friends was going down, and even people that know me from back then. You know, just talking to someone six months ago, he's like bro, like I was telling my wife. He's like I was bad, yo Jay was bad, bad, like it's crazy. Seeing him today he's like a whole different person. But it was the trade man HVAC literally did. It changed my life, it saved my life.

Speaker 2: 10:41

And the part that breaks my heart is we have this labor shortage around the country, this labor shortage even locally in Massachusetts, and we have all these minorities that have no idea about the type of money that you can make. And then even people in the field, in the industry. They don't understand that you don't have to make $60,000, $70,000, $80,000 a year. You can make. All my guys last year made $300,000, $80,000 a year. You can make. All my guys last year made 300 grand, because the biggest difference that I always preach, that I learned, and it took me a while to learn this is where you want to be financially, where you are and where you want to be.

Speaker 2: 11:11

There's a gap, and that gap is filled with better communication skills. And it sounds cliche and everybody thinks they're really good at communicating, but what I found is, when I really started diving into this process and over the last, let's say, four years, I found out how really bad I was at communicating. And then I find out even more, so I get frustrated, find out how bad everyone else is at communicating. Right, and so that's, that's always been my thing, that I preach. It's like, if you want to, really I don't really care what industry it is, it really doesn't matter. I was at Profit Rocket a few years ago and Ed Milet was speaking and he was saying the number one thing that he can attribute to the amount of money that he's made was his communication skills. It's like, come on, man, like the dude's, like almost worth a billion dollars Communication, communication. So that's really what sales is. And if you really want to take away all the the tricks and the methods and everything, if I could dial it down to one thing it's increased communication skills.

Speaker 1: 12:12

Yeah, yeah, you know, I totally agree with that. I totally agree with that being able to, you know, lots of times just being able to shut up and listen. I mean, I've seen so many people that just you know that they just get excited or they don't understand that. You know, when you talk over somebody it's disrespectful, I mean, and I don't think people realize it. No, I mean, and I don't think people realize it. No, so what do you think? What do you think the defining moment was for you to make that decision as a young guy, to be able to see the vision of I don't want to go down this path.

Speaker 2: 12:55

What do you? What was it? There had to be something to happen. Yeah, so when I was 14 and I honestly didn't even know what HVAC was and I was in the different trade shops and I was in the trade and I'm like I kind of like this shop, like it's kind of cool. And you know, this is back in like 2000, 1999, something like that, and I haven't been early in that 98. And so the Internet was kind of not what it was today really. So I was looking up some stuff, I was looking up some jobs and I kept seeing like there's two things that really stuck out to me. I kept seeing that there was all these like $4,000, $5,000, $10,000 signing bonuses for HVAC techs. And then I started like looking around at other trades at the time and I didn't see that. I was like that's kind of interesting, you know.

Speaker 2: 13:41

And then the next thing that happened was when I was like 17,. I just decided, instead of like using the schools, companies that they used, I just went on my own. You know my mom, she my mom's. You know I grew up in a single black family household, so my mom's black, and she always taught me like listen, regardless of how you feel about it, you're going to have to work like 110%. You're going to have to work twice as hard as some other people sometimes because your color and so even for this industry, like that's great, but I'll be 100% dead. Honest man, when I started in this field, there was like nobody that looked like me, like I'd go to places and it'd just be 45 year old white guys, and so I'd sit down for an interview as an apprentice and I'm 17 year old, punk basically and there's all these 45, 47, 48 year old white guys and something clicked and I was like yo, where are these guys going to be in 20 years? They're going to be retired or whatever, and I'm going to be thriving, right. I'm going to be my age right now, right. And so it was that moment that I realized I wanted to start my own business. I had like this whole plan and everything what I wanted to do. And it's cool because I'll talk to my wife sometimes and I'm like yo, I'm literally living my dream. I had this planned out since I was 14 to 17 years old. I figured this out then.

Speaker 2: 15:34

That's probably a nugget for young people that I always stress. I always ask them what is it that you want to do? The common theme that I see with young people is oh no, maybe this, maybe that I'm like listen, you got to figure it out right now, because the time flies by. But more than the time flying by, when you spread yourself out like this, you're not a specialist in anything, you're a generalist, and you don't get paid for that. That's the other part. You want to have really high communication skills and you want to be extremely specialized, and when you put those two together, you're priceless. You could do anything, you can go anywhere, you can ask for whatever you want.

Speaker 1: 16:14

Yeah, dude, I 100% agree. Yeah, I totally agree. I mean that's, you know, communication is one of the God knows it's one of the biggest. You take service technicians. I mean I'm not knocking service technicians, but they're technicians. They're not great communicators. Um, and I think a lot of that's because, well, I'll just be completely honest with you because in trade schools they don't teach communication. They don't teach that you got to talk to customers. If you don't have a conversation with a customer, you're not going to be able to fix their, their system or whatever're there for their plumbing or whatever it is. So it's mind-boggling to me why that is not taught Makes no sense. I agree with you. Yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 2: 17:04

Yeah, that's actually the biggest switch too, because you know really getting into the meat of it. You know, as service techs they're going to know. You know that's how I started off as a service tech, so I can speak. You know from experiences and especially, again, what my mama was teaching me. So, believe me, when I was 21, 22 and I was at some commercial building fixing their HVAC system, man, I would speak in all types of like technical jargon because I'm like I got to show you that I'm the man. I know what I'm talking about. You know, because some of these places I go into I look like a baby and they're like yo, where's your boss at? I'm like, yo, I'm the you know. So I got used to this whole technical jargon and so, fast forward, I'm 27, 28.

Speaker 2: 17:47

I started my company and I'm thinking that that's what sells and so I'm in these people's homes talking about these things and it was one customer in particular. I'll never forget him. He's actually a customer today. We just sold him something else. This is, which is kind of the cool thing about having a business that's like 13 years old now, like starting to see like the repeat customers that were like OG customers back in the day, but he was one of my first customers and I'm talking going crazy and he was like listen, man, all this sounds great, but I'm going to tell you something. Like my eyes are starting to glaze over and I was like you know what? I think I'm saying way too much, man, like I need to slow down. I have a tendency to talk real fast and I need to start asking way more questions and so, yes, I kind of just started down that journey.

Speaker 1: 18:35

Yeah, I ask you questions. It's incredibly important and people will tell you in their own words what it is they are looking for. And if you could just mirror back and use their own words, they're going to understand. But if you start throwing a bunch of technical jargon out there, they're smart because maybe they were you know, maybe they probably weren't great in school and maybe they've never felt smart before, and so they use that, as you know. I guess they think it's leverage, but the reality is hurting them more than it is helping them 100% is no-transcript.

Speaker 2: 19:46

The next one is the limbic system, which is going to be responsible for a lot of emotion and feeling, and then there's the neocortex that's going to be responsible for analyzing and logic and language, and so a lot of times the problem is a lot of sales things that I see people talking about. It's all neocortex Service techs. When they're going into a home, they're talking neocortex and the problem is neocortex. Anything that's neocortex is going to make the same. You can expect the same result every single time when you're speaking neocortex. And that sounds like this is a lot of great information. I want to think it over. If you're getting I want to think it over, it's because you're speaking to their neocortex and you need to change it. And the reason why I know that is because we have Rilla in my company and when I'm hearing, oh, they just want to think it over. Oh, it was a price objection.

Speaker 2: 20:37

I'll go back and listen and every time I'm like stop for a second. Let me ask you this you spoke 87% of the time and they only spoke whatever 13% of the time. So in what area do you feel like you really could work on the most? And they're like questions. I'm like exactly Because if you're asking questions, what are you doing? That's exactly what Corey said earlier You're shutting the hell up and you're listening. And I'm like, and the funny thing is, when you really listen not just listen to, just talk and say something else you start I call them red flags. I start seeing all these little red flags and for me, those red flags are things that I don't know. So they might say something like you know, this system hasn't been working for like two years, so the average salesperson, what they'll do is they'll just hear that and gloss over it. Oh, ok, cool, yeah, so for me that's a red flag Hold up.

Speaker 2: 21:29

You just said something that's interesting. I don't know what you mean by that. So I'm like two years, like I'll mirror that, right, and they'll say yeah, and they'll start giving me more information, like, oh yeah, it's been the two years and you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, like OK. So now my next question, I'm thinking, is well, what have you been doing to keep your house cool during this whole time? So then I'll ask that you know. Well, let me ask you, what have you been doing to keep the house cool for the last two years? Oh, we've been using window air conditioners.

Speaker 2: 22:00

Okay, how do you feel about that? To be honest, I hate it. Why? Well, the window ACs? They do the job, right, they do, but they're musty, they're smelly. When you say musty, what do you mean by that?

Speaker 2: 22:15

It's just, honestly, I'm very sensitive to like I don't know what it is, the mold or whatever, right, and I start really drilling into it. I'm like, okay, and what else? Well, it's also really loud. So I'm trying to listen to the TV. I have to turn it up, and so I really like, build all this stuff up where the average salesperson will just move right past it and lose that opportunity, and that's what makes sales right there.

Speaker 2: 22:38

That right there is that people just want to keep talking and they'll just, and so again in Rilla. What's really nice is I can listen to these things, or my sales managers can listen. They can put a comment right in it and be like yo, right here, what do you think you should have done? You should have asked more questions, you should have drilled in instead of just being like, okay, yeah, they don't want window ACs, because again, what we'll do is we'll gloss by all of that, we'll go through the entire process, we'll come to the finish line, and then the customer says, yeah, that's great, I want to get more options, or I don't know. To be honest, we might just bear through it. Summer's almost halfway. You know stuff like that and they'll go.

Speaker 1: 23:24

I don't understand they. You know it was a P one call on my board and they were super motivated. Yeah, yeah, I totally agree, because there is a reason why they hung on to it for two years and there's a reason why you're in the house and you got to figure those things out because they didn't call you, because they were bored.

Speaker 2: 23:39

Exactly. I think the part two you got to do is you got to push back on these people, man, because too many salespeople are afraid to have certain types of conversations and I feel like, again, they're losing sales because of it. So if I hear that someone's had window ACs for the last two years and they're giving me not really strong buying signals, like they're not giving me great answers as to why I'm here, then I'm going to just be like, well, I mean, I don't know, the window ACs work right. Like they've been cool in the space, like why not just keep using those? And I mean, if you're looking for the cheapest route, corey, like just keep the window ACs in. Like what's wrong with that? And then now they're going to really give me the real response.

Speaker 2: 24:23

If you read the book Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss which I everybody should have that in their van driving around in between stuff or whatever he calls it, the black swan. And so when you ask enough questions and really get down to it, you'll find that really juicy piece of meat that they were holding back on. So now they'll be like well, honestly, I just got divorced from my husband and I really can't lift these things and I don't have anybody to really help me and I'm just gravely afraid that I'm going to hurt myself or one of my kids trying to put these in the windows. And I'm honestly really scared too, because I feel like someone could really break in easily to my home. Boom, when you don't go down that path, you miss all that.

Speaker 2: 25:10

And so now, if it does come to the end and I'm talking to the homeowner and they're like, yeah, I think we're going to hold off or we're going to get some other quote or whatever excuse it is, I can say, okay, well, you know, sandy, I'm kind of confused because I remember earlier you were saying all those things that you brought up. What changed? She'll give me more excuses and I'll be like let me ask you a question. How do you feel about the price? Oh, the price is pretty high, okay, and that's an easy one at that point. It's just a price objection at that, you know.

Speaker 1: 25:41

Yeah, but you got to ask that question because the truth of the matter is that's usually what it is. They don't like the price, and you just got to get that. You just got to get out in front of it and you just got to be transparent with them, and it is usually about the price, or you know, at least that's what they say, and so if you get that answer back, then you have an opportunity to finish building the value that maybe you missed something or maybe you didn't ask the right questions, and but it's also you got to take your time. You know a lot of guys, you know especially it's getting hot here anyway and you know we get an influx of calls, like everybody else in the country, and I think that, um, you know that they're thinking about the next call and you got to be present in the current situation. You've got to be present with the homeowner because if you're not and you're thinking about the next call, you're thinking about the last call there's no way you can be.

Speaker 1: 26:43

I can't be here with you if I'm thinking about what I got to do at three o'clock today yep and I can't be here with you if I'm thinking about what I did at nine o'clock this morning and so I miss. I miss so much and this is something I've been working hard on recently. Uh, and I agree with you, with Chris Voss this is literally the third conversation I've had about this book in the last three, not even three days, two days. I'm a massive fan, like. I've listened to his book several times. Yep, yeah, he's good and I do encourage people to check that out for sure. And no oriented questions, man, I mean, I can go on and on about this, like it's. It's so interesting because most people, when you ask a no oriented question, they still answer with yes, it's the funniest thing to me, but their brain doesn't pick it up. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 27:38

I love no oriented questions. That was probably one of the trickiest things for me to wrap my and this is what I mean by advanced speaking right. It's ways that we normally wouldn't speak to people. If I'm on the phone with you and I want to, I don't cold call people. But if I did, some people are like, corey, do you have just three minutes that I can go over your software with you? Nope, I don't when. If I say, corey, let me ask you a question, like you know, I'm not even sure if we're going to be a right fit, but, you know, would you just be opposed to five minutes to even see if there's some way that I could help you? Right, no same response, but now it's in my favor, it's in my direction and now I got at least five minutes to seal the deal. In fact, one of the things I do right off the rip is you know, let's role play. Like I call you and I'm, like you know, ring, ring, ring.

Speaker 1: 28:30

Hello.

Speaker 2: 28:31

Hey Corey.

Speaker 1: 28:32

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 28:33

Hey, Corey, it's Jonathan at Green Energy. Did I catch you in the middle of something?

Speaker 1: 28:41

Well, Jonathan, I'm going to be able to come cook a dinner right now, but what can I help you with?

Speaker 2: 28:44

Boom. And so now I get that permission to actually get my point across. I can't tell you how many calls I get where it's like hey, jonathan, it's Corey at XYZ company I just wanted to talk to you about and I might literally be in the middle of something and it's like bro, that's so rude, but, like 90% of people do it, and just like you did that, I love your response because that's real. That's like how most of the responses come out, where they'll be like I'm walking into a meeting but you know how can. Like what's going on, I got like two minutes Perfect. If I didn't say that, most likely that would have ended that call. And another one of my expressions I teach all the time is anything that can end the call or end the sale. I need to say it first, and when you start to get good at that, you'll start to.

Speaker 2: 29:34

You know, probably one of my favorite examples of this is I was at a customer's home and she used us for one of her rental properties and now her AC started acting up. And so I get to the home and I'm doing some sales training with one of my guys, so he's with me and he was floored by this because she's like, yeah, we had an AC system and it hasn't been working. And I'm like, oh, what's going on? She's like, well, I'm not really sure. It just stops working and my husband has to go out and he literally shakes it and it starts working again. And I'm like, ok, she's like it's been working great, you know. I'm like all right, how long has it been working great for? Well, it's intermittent. Sometimes he shakes it. It lasts for a week. Sometimes he shakes it and lasts for 10 minutes and has to go back out and shake it again. So while she's saying this, her husband now walks in the room and now here's like Mr you could tell his energy is like we're not really doing anything If this AC has been working great. And so I, again I push back on them.

Speaker 2: 30:42

So I'm not just going to be like, well, I'm here, I'm going to give you all these options and at the end, if there's, is there any reason why you, you know you wouldn't want to say yesterday. It's like, you know, you're a clown. Instead, I'm like well, frank, I have a phenomenal idea. Why don't we go to? And I say it just like this, right? So I already know what I'm getting at. But I'm like you know why don't we go to Walmart and we'll buy a lazy chair and one of those big sun umbrellas and you can tell they have no idea where I'm going with this right, big sun umbrellas and you work from home, right? He's like yeah, yeah, like perfect. So you're working from home and you can work outside, and when the AC stops working, you're just right there and you could just give this thing a quick shake. And it was like weird, because it was like this weird awkward silence and they just looked at each other and they started dying laughing. They're like I actually love the idea. And then now here comes the black swan and that's where they're like to be honest, we tried shaking it last week and the thing just did not come on at all and I haven't got it to be able to work since and I'm afraid that we're going to get into the really hot season and it's not going to work. Ah, I see. So it sounds like there's some value to getting this taken care of sooner than later. Oh yeah, absolutely Awesome, we are filling up quickly.

Speaker 2: 31:54

What was your timeframe for this? And then they'll tell me and then I'm like awesome. So here's what my plan is. I'll game plan with them and then at the end I'll do a mini close and what I'll say is, once I'm done with all the measurements and design of the system, I'm going to ask you guys, sit down, we'll go over some options. We'll go over the most premium option down to the cheapest option and do me a favor, just pick the one that's best for you and your family. How's that sound? And they're like, sounds good, like awesome. And then you know and let me ask you this, frank, if I can if one of those options, you know, checks all the boxes for you and takes care of all your needs and I can even find a way to make it affordable for you what would happen then? And then he was like he looks at her and she's like, well, just go ahead and do it.

Speaker 2: 32:42

I told the person that was with me at that moment I'm like I haven't even gone through the rest of the call yet. I already sold the job. Yeah, it's my job to lose at this point. I already, I already want it, and that's that same type of process all the time. And even some people will say what if they say you know, they're going to have to think about it. Or well, I got other people. You know, you're not the only one. I'm like that's perfect. That's literally what I'm looking for, because if I ask you that, corey, and you're like, well, I got three other people coming, you're one of three. Awesome, that sounds good.

Speaker 2: 33:20

So when are you getting your other quotes? Well, one person came. He came last week. Still haven't got a quote yet from him. I got two other people coming One's coming after you and then one's coming tomorrow morning. I have phenomenal information I can use. I can decide to have a revisit at the end of that meeting. Right, I can decide during the meeting where I can just tell this dude's like, you know what, I'm getting a ton of great buying signals. Maybe I'm just going to try to land it right there. Right, you got a lot of moves that you can have at that point. But again, if you're not asking those questions, you just missed all that opportunity and at the end, corey's going to say this is great, you know, this was awesome, a lot of information. I have one quote I'm waiting on and two other coming tomorrow. So we'll get back to you and guarantee at that point. They're just looking at all of them and figuring out who's the cheapest and picking one of them, and you're probably not going to get it.

Speaker 1: 34:15

If you're a premium company, you're right. So I'm going to tell you firsthand. So when I started working where I'm working now I do have an older system it worked fine. There's no issues with it. However, I felt this is an opportunity for me to see what I'm dealing with for the competition in this area. So I called out five different companies and I sat here all day and I'm going to tell you something I didn't understand how I would feel at the end of that day, but I was so confused and I'm in the industry I brought them out specifically for a reason to understand how their process goes.

Speaker 1: 35:03

The next day I sat down with my guy and he said all right, so what did so-and-so offer? I went hmm, I think it was X, y or Z. He has quotes in front of him. He was like all right, what about so-and-so? I was like, hmm, you know, I think it was. I was wrong. I'll be honest with you. By the fourth one, I made up something because I didn't want to look stupid like I didn't remember.

Speaker 1: 35:32

The point here is that if you've got that many people coming out, there's and I know what I'm doing and I know what I'm looking for and I was confused and I couldn't remember. There's zero chance that somebody that's not in the industry is going to know what they're looking at. At the end of the day, the point is, is they're going to make a decision based on the numbers? Because on the quotes? Because they don't. They don't remember that it was a modulating system and they don't remember.

Speaker 1: 36:08

Unless you've gone through we sell Daikin primarily and unless you've explained to them the energy savings and you've actually had them put a pen in their hand and write out how much money they're going to save and spend the time to walk them through all the energy savings they're going to get with that modulating system. They're going to look at that system and go, oh, that one's 15 grand. With the others, others are around 12. I'm just going to go with the 12. They're all the same. I was battered by the end of the day. I was so shot that there's zero chance. Even if I was going to do it, I wouldn't have made a decision because I was worn out. The point is, if you're that fourth or heaven forbid fifth guy, you need to reset that appointment because they don't have the capacity to make a decision. Even if you give them the best, best presentation ever, you need to wait to the next day when their head's clear you got it.

Speaker 2: 37:11

You got it. Yeah, man, I um, I think, in addition to that too, you know, one of the things I see a lot is, and again, even with guys that I see struggling, I'll say, like, show me your options. You know, like and this is HVAC contractors around the country that I'll speak with Show me your options, what you're struggling with. And I'm like, man, the problem with this option, bro, even that Daikin system, that's great. Maybe other people are just offering a 13-seer Daikin, but what if another good company comes? Where are you located?

Speaker 1: 37:46

North Carolina.

Speaker 2: 37:48

Okay, I don't know anybody in that area, but somebody's coming up in that area, boom, and then they're like yeah, we have a Daikin system and it's like oh okay.

Speaker 2: 37:56

So like my big thing is is if, if the modulation is important to something we talked about, like some sort of pain point, like this unit is so loud, like, oh, wow, like you said, man, my energy bills are wild.

Speaker 2: 38:12

Tell me more about that, right, and I'll get more info. That's where the modulating is going to come into play. That gets back to what we talked about earlier, where most salespeople will just get geeked out on the technical specs of whatever that they're selling and then be like oh, this thing has a variable speed blower and a modulating gas valve and a this and a that, and it's like I don't care, like I'm just going to, but instead for me, like I'm going to find out something I can tie to the pain I could be like remember we talked about earlier and you said how you have to turn the TV up every single time that that system comes on. Yeah Well, I went ahead and I included this. You know, whatever it is a modulating system, because I want to make sure that it runs so low and slow that when you're running it, you literally have to go and put your foot next to the register, even though it's running. That's how quiet it is. I have the same system in my house. I can't even believe how much better it is, and you'll hear even my tone drops like that. It's exactly how I say it every time.

Speaker 2: 39:15

Remember, too, we were talking about the dust in the home and allergies, and how you were concerned about the mold and mildew on there and you brought up whatever pain, pain points about rounding that. That's why I included and and this is real important, because again I'll see a lot of people on their quotes remy, halo, uh, you know air bear. Try on air bear. Right, I'll have an indoor air quality uh system. So now I'll say so. This is the reason why I included our complete air treatment package. Do you know what that is? And they'll say, no, I'm like well, what that's going to do is that's going to take care of all the mold, all the mildew, all the this, all the that. It's going to purify the air, it's going to sanitize the system. It's going to filter out particles down to a microscopic level, and what that means for you is you can have peace of mind, knowing that your family's breathing the freshest air possible.

Speaker 2: 40:07

I did this. My nephew works for me and he's starting he's actually really starting to crush it. And one of the first jobs about seven months ago that he did a ride along with me, I did this with a lady and she started crying. And she started crying and she was like I do care about clean air. And then she went ahead and signed up for everything and I'm like, damn man, this punk's going to be thinking that this is how every sale is easy. You know like that's rare.

Speaker 2: 40:38

But my point is is you got to tie whatever it is back? The other side, too is I just offered you something that nobody else offered you and you can't google it. Try googling the my complete air treatment package. You're gonna. You're gonna find probably some crazy expensive commercial, whatever the crap. Right, when I'm putting Remy Halo for 1500 bucks, customer goes on there and I I think this was to the point that guys post the other day was like I'm trying to sell more indoor air quality. You're probably doing what I'm talking about, which is you're going in and you're talking about how it's going to clean up dust and all this stuff Never had the conversation up front about, if that's even a concern. You're using the actual name brands of the things and the guys can Google it and say why are you charging me $1,500 for a Remy Halo that I can buy on Amazon for $395? And I just looked up this YouTube video that shows that I can probably install this in like 20 minutes. You can't Google my stuff.

Speaker 2: 41:43

I just had this happen literally last week. I had a guy with me again doing ride along, and this customer man he was, he was tough and it was a 52,000, no $54,000 sale. And he was like I want extreme discount. And I'm like, when you say extreme, what do you mean by that? And he was like I want it for 46 grand. I'm like, okay, well, there's not. I wish there was that much margin in the job, but unfortunately there's not. And so we ended up he ended up signing at the 54, or, excuse me, he didn't.

Speaker 2: 42:16

He took out the I think it was a little bit higher than that. He took out the indoor air quality stuff, the complete air treatment package. So he had Stanley Steamer that was coming to clean his ducts because it was cheaper than what we were going to do it for before we did the job. And then Stanley Steamer says hey, you know, I know you don't have any under air quality, and this is actually a great example to tee up what I'm talking about. You don't have any under air quality in here, so we can go ahead and put an air purification system and carbon filtration in both of these systems for $1,800.

Speaker 2: 42:46

So two systems for $1,800, right, my one system costs $2,545. So he has two of them. So we're talking over $5,000 for mine option versus $1,800. Huge difference. I don't give a shit. I don't care about the price. I can't stress this enough when it comes to sales guys, because our prices are too high. Yo, shut the hell up. It's not the price, it's your mindset.

Speaker 2: 43:12

So now Paul comes back and he's like hey man, stanley Steamer said they can do both systems for 1800 bucks. Can you do? You know, buy one, get one free, do it for 2545. I said, paul, I wish I could. Man, it sounds like if you got that for $1,800, it's probably a good price. But let me ask you a question have you done any research on exactly what they're offering for $1,800? So then he looked it up because they showed him what it was, and he was like oh man, it's only this much money. And I'm like yeah, and did you see any videos how there's like Remy Halos, literally with like mold on them, like the one thing they're supposed to be getting rid of.

Speaker 2: 43:55

Here's the problem. In our industry is there's a plethora of purification systems and filtration systems and a lot of them are glorified blacklights. Are you interested in buying a glorified blacklight for $1,800? He was like I didn't. No, definitely not. I don't know, I don't want that. I'm like right, I understand, ours is more money. Can I explain why ours is 25, 45 each? He gives me. He says yes, that's permission-based selling, right? I'm not just going to go into all the reasons, I'm going to ask him for permission first and then now I'm going into those reasons and I start to tell him this purifies down to 0.3 microns. Do you know what that means? I start telling him what that means. This also sanitizes the coil. It has a separate light that does that. The one you're looking at doesn't. This has a much stronger UVC light, so that way you can be confident that it's going to actually kill all the germs, viruses, bacteria, mold and mildew and keep your system and your home cleaner, fresher and healthier.

Speaker 2: 44:58

Was that what you were looking for? He was like yeah, that is. I'm like okay, so what should we do? Can you just do it for like four grand? I said, here's what I can do. I can order these things and we can go ahead and put them in for whatever it was. It was like 5,000 XYZ. So he's like, okay, let's just go ahead and add those in. Then that's it, because I was also detached from the outcome. If he decides to say no, he says no.

Speaker 1: 45:22

A hundred percent yeah.

Speaker 2: 45:24

And he didn 100.

Speaker 1: 45:26

Yeah, and see that right, it gets 100 and yeah, that makes total sense. And you know, if you push on the thing, I mean, look, we all want to breathe clean oxygen, right? I mean, if you knew your kids were not breathing clean oxygen, would you change that? Of course you would, right, you write a check for whatever that was if you had money. Right, you get it done today because you care about your kids. We breathe oxygen. Everybody breathes eight hours of oxygen at least in their house every single day, 365 days out of the year, probably more. Seems like it's pretty important and you just get them to agree with that right Period.

Speaker 2: 46:08

Yep, I mean, and I could probably go against most in the country I highly doubt anyone selling that setup for $2,500 plus. I have another one above it that's $3,500. That has like just a slightly better filter. My point is is back in the day I used to sell that Remy Halo for $9.99. I couldn't sell it for the life of me. Like people would be like, no, I'm good, right. And I would be like, okay, well, I then was like, cause, what I did is, I'd say, advanced air filtration or no, I'm sorry, I would say, try on air bear for whatever the price was, and then the Remy Halo and we could do both of them for $14.95. And people would say no, all day to me. I sell basically the same thing now for $25.45. All I did was change the name to something you can't Google and just have a good explanation onto why and, like I said, tied it back to whatever we talked about earlier. And they sell all the time.

Speaker 2: 47:06

I had a job a couple weeks ago where you could tell the customer was just super price conscious and and this gets back to what this story, what I'm about to say, it gets back to what I mean by sales are 100% emotional, all in the limbic system, and I always tell my guys you should be if you. What you want to imagine is, when you're doing your sales presentation, if they were to fold their arms and slide into an MRI and you had scans on their brain. I think that's what scans your brain. I don't know you want their limbic system just lighting up the whole time. That's what you want to imagine, with your questions and what you're saying and your tone and everything right. And so we get to the presentation part. We're talking about a ducted whole home heat pump and one room ductless.

Speaker 2: 47:53

We get to my complete air treatment package. I go into the whole thing and explain it and then at the end of it, I'm like you know, I'm like so you know, how do you feel about that? Whatever? I forget exactly what question I asked and he was like yeah, I got to tell you you're definitely a lot more money than the other people he's like, but nobody's talked to us about that air treatment package you brought up, and so I didn't even get to say it yet. But one of the sales guys I was training he said it before me and he asked a perfect, brilliant question that I gave him mad kudos at the end for and he was like what is it about it that you like the most, or something to that effect. What is it that you like the best about it? Something like that. And the response was completely limbic or emotional. And what happened is they went, I mean, and then the wife was like we like clean air.

Speaker 2: 48:49

So I was talking about. I'm like did you see what just happened there? Stop for a second. Do you remember how long they've been living in that home? For he was like, yeah, they said 14 years. For 14 years they didn't care about clean air for 14 years. Of course, right, but at the end, when now we're bringing this up, they don't even have a logical response, for what they're telling me is their answer that tells you their limbic system was on fire. And that's really what limbic is. When you say like, oh, I had a bad feeling about something, we don't even have a word for what that is, we'd call it a bad feeling. Right? That's limbic system. It doesn't really compute with language, it just feels good. And that's what those types of things do.

Speaker 2: 49:34

Where we're going to come in and completely treat this air in your home. I do it with ductless systems. I know ductless is huge People. They don't know how to like add air purification. I created a system in our company for it. We have a HEPA filter. We attach a UV light to it, we have a supply and return duct and we'll put supply and return ducts in your attic or in your basement, whatever you want, and it's not tied to a ducted system, but we make it like a ducted system and we charge really good money for that. I think we charge close to six grand for that. And you know, we had one lady, for instance, a couple of weeks ago, was doing another ride along and she's like I had three people out. No one's ever talked to me about that.

Speaker 2: 50:20

We call it the complete air treatment plus package and, and she was like no one's ever talked to me about that before, and she's like, and I was like. How I tied it to her, though, is because, when we walked in, she said Can you guys wear a mask? And I said, sure. So when we came in, there's a red flag. Why do you want us to wear a mask? She's like Well, thank you so much for wearing the masks. I said yeah, sure you know, asked her about it, and she's like well, my mom stays with us from time to time and she's immune, compromised, so I really appreciate the fact that you did that. So what do you think? I tied my complete air treatment plus package back to, and I actually did a crappy job, like I learned a lesson from it, because she had a two story colonial. I just had a complete air. I had the treatment package for the basement. She bought the whole thing.

Speaker 2: 51:10

The next day she calls me up and she's like can I ask you a question, what's the plan for the second floor? And I was like what do you mean by that? She's like well, my mom stays with us and she sleeps upstairs and we don't have anything for up there. And I'm like, oh, I'm like, oh, I'm like, yeah, absolutely, you know. So she's like we add that package to the second floor as well. I'm like you 100% can, right, and they went ahead and did that. And I was like you know what? That was a lesson for me. I just assumed, right, yep, instead of actually saying, hey, you know what? My top, top, complete air treatment for the top floor, a complete air treatment for the bottom floor. That way when your mom comes here, she can have peace of mind going throughout the entire place knowing that she has the freshest air possible. Would that help you? Oh my god, that would help tremendously. Perfect, that was a 60 turned to be a 63 000 mini split ductless heat pump. Job, nice, play it.

Speaker 1: 52:04

Duckless, he'd punch up Nice, yeah, dude, yeah, that's 100%. Anybody tells me to put on a mask. It should be a done deal, because you know they're nervous about whatever. It is COVID or they're nervous about something. And I love what Chris Voss says. Just call out Whatever they're thinking. I know you probably think that I'm here to rip you off. You probably think I'm here to throw you out at a high price. You probably think I'm here to just sell you a system. Just call it out. But yeah, you've got to be conscious of when you see that mask. You've got to be able to tie. Why is that? And you, you got to ask the question. You can't assume because you never know.

Speaker 2: 52:50

You never know.

Speaker 1: 52:51

And if you assume you may pick the wrong one, and then you've boxed yourself out.

Speaker 2: 52:58

Man, you can't assume. Like even there was another group I think it was on Jason Walker's group Somebody was having a hard time with a sense of urgency. So I ended up talking to this individual and a couple others on the same topic. Same thing. Man just making assumptions oh, it's before summer, he just wants to get it done. Or people. And then, when it gets to the end, they're like yeah, we're going to wait. And I'm like, well, what's your method for building sense of urgency? Oh, telling them that there's rebates and that prices are going to go up. I'm like, okay, well, how do you know? Those are things that they even care about. I don't. I'm like, what happens if those don't work? I don't know. That's like that's the only move you got. Okay, so like, like you gotta. So like again, even for me, I don't care if it's 95 degrees out. The person's AC is broken. I am not assuming anything, or at least I try not to. I'm not trying to, you know exactly. So like last summer, same thing, doing a ride along with a guy, this P1 call comes in. It's a 30-year-old unit, person wants a new system. And they're like oh, this is a great call, can you squeeze this one in Right off the rip. I don't feel like that's such a great call. I know a lot of people would look and be like, oh, that's a juicy one.

Speaker 2: 54:16

The first question I got off the top of my head is why do you have a 30-year-old system? Like, why didn't you replace this thing sooner? Like this thing has been old for years. Sure enough, when I go there two different people I'm talking to the husband, the husband showing me around and I'm just getting that energy. Like he really doesn't want to do this. He's real concerned about the price. And so I'm like you know how long have you lived here? For 35 years. I'm like, oh, so you put the system in. Then I did, awesome. And who's been maintaining it? I've been maintaining it.

Speaker 2: 54:48

I also have a brother-in-law. He's an electrician, so he's been helping me. I'm like, oh, okay. And so when things break, what happens? Then he's like, oh, my brother-in-law would come and help diagnose it and we'd keep the thing fixed. I'm like, okay, you probably just want to. I mean, why are you looking to get it replaced now? Why not just try to get some more life out of the system? You got 30 years, why not 35? Most salespeople are never going to ask that, because they're petrified that the person's going to say you know what? You're right, right. So to me I'm like why not try to just get more years out of it, right? So then he goes here's the thing we tried.

Speaker 2: 55:26

My brother-in-law came. We thought it was a bad capacitor. He replaced the capacitor. It didn't work.

Speaker 2: 55:34

And I'm like what was the problem? He's like he thinks it's the compressor. I'm not going to make any more assumptions, right? So I still ask more questions. I'm like, oh well, I mean I don't know. I mean I don't know if they make the compressor for this system. I mean, it's pretty old Kenmore air conditioner. But what happens if they do make the compressor? For would you be interested in just replacing the compressor? And I want him to sell me, right? So he's like dude, I'm not putting six, six. Oh no, I'm sorry. He said I did look it up I couldn't find it, but even still, it looks like it's probably going to be six, seven grand. I'm like yeah, that's about accurate.

Speaker 2: 56:12

He's like I'm not putting six, seven grand into a 30 year old system. I'm like, okay. I'm like so what have you been doing to keep cool window ACs? I'm like okay, how do you like them? He's like I honestly don't care. It's my wife that is like dead set against it and she's like the one pushing this entire thing. So now my next thing was where's the wife? She's in the air conditioning, so I made it away. We're like, okay, I got to measure and did space and I made sure I introduced myself to her because she was in the room working, came in hey, sarah, how you doing? I'm Jonathan Green. Do you have a few minutes just to sit with us at the table and just go over some things, because I am absolutely bringing her in. When I brought her in, the whole mood changed and now I'm talking to her and eventually she's like when can you do it? Bam, and then we were able to get it done.

Speaker 2: 56:55

So my point is is it's all question-based selling, trying to find out that black swan that you're not getting because you're not asking things and you're just making assumptions? I don't care if it's March and there is no weather, or if it's 95 degrees out and it's crazy hot and the thing broke yesterday. I'm not assuming anything. I'm always going to push back and I'm going to get them to be like I want to get this thing done, and sometimes the responses are crazy. People are like what, are you stupid? Like no, I want to get this thing done. I love it when I get those types of responses, man, that energy is huge, because I'm like okay, so it sounds like there's some value to getting this taken care of. So if I go ahead and put some options together and one of them you end up liking and checks all the boxes and I can even make it affordable, corey, what would happen then? I mean, we'll probably get it done. Hell, yeah, you're going to get it done, and then we'll get to the end, and if you don't have that same energy at the end, I'm going to call you out on that too.

Speaker 2: 57:52

Like Corey, you almost kicked me out because I said why don't you try to get more life out of the system? What changed, man? Oh, you know, honestly, man, the price is expensive. I can understand that, man, it's a premium investment, but when you say the price is expensive, what do you mean by that? Well, I just mean, like you know, one of my buddies got this done in 2019 and it was XYZ price. Okay, and you're talking pre-COVID days, like before hyperinflation? Oh, that's a good point. I've had that a lot. That's a really good point. Like, yeah, I'm like you know, especially with the type of systems we're doing.

Speaker 2: 58:29

They have semiconductors. You remember what happened with semiconductors at that time? There was a shortage, exactly. So what do you think happened once they started to come back? Do you think they ever came down on the price? Do you think they just kept going up? It kept going up, yeah, so do you think it makes sense then that the price in 2019 probably isn't accurate? Yeah, so what should we do? Yeah, can you come down two thousand dollars? I wish I could.

Speaker 2: 58:53

I'll go into those that situation and you know, whatever, sometimes they'll say oh, I got this other guy said you can do it for like five grand cheaper. It's like okay, can I explain why ours is five grand more and go, you know? But anyways, my point is is I, I think you, you gotta stop like for some of these sales guys, I think what? What they'll think is? Or just business owners in general, it's not even just sales guys they'll go on looking for these like silver bullet answers I can't sell iqAQ, what should I do?

Speaker 2: 59:26

And it's not like oh, just you know, I'll see the answers all the time, like you just got to go in there and build rapport. You just got to go in there and ask questions. It's like, yeah, but like it's that's like one cog in the wheel right, like you got to have the whole thing, you know. Like, if you're coming in and asking great questions, are those questions that are even leading to anything? I I see guys asking what'd you think about the game last night? And oh my god, that's a beautiful deck, like how long you know they'll go into the wood that they use on the deck. And it's like, yeah, you're asking questions, but they're retarded questions, like questions that don't go anywhere, like and then they'll ask leading questions. If I did this, would you, would I have seen something you'd want to move forward with today? And people are like pump the brakes, homie Right.

Speaker 1: 1:00:12

Yeah, that's when you would ask would you disagree? Is something we need to get done today?

Speaker 2: 1:00:17

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:00:19

It's just a total shift. I mean, yeah, sorry, I went on like a tangent there. No, you're good dude, like it's mind-boggling. And you know, I'm just, I'm really grateful that you think the way you do, I'm really grateful that you do train people like you do, because there's not a ton of people out there that you know that think the way we do, and it's really needed. So you know, I'm curious, have you? You know, are you? Have you thought about how? I mean, how do you? How do you? And it's just a personal question Like how can you reach more people? Because you've got good stuff, I mean the stuff you're talking about. You know it all makes sense to me and I agree with all of it. So do you feel like you're reaching enough people with this information? Because it's important.

Speaker 2: 1:01:09

You know it's funny because I've actually had a few people talk to me about this exact thing recently in the last month or so and, to be honest, it really wasn't anything I ever really thought about before because I feel like my vision was kind of more on my company and what I've realized is that it is a bigger issue and problem nationwide. And what I realized too is it's not sales. I know we're talking about sales with this whole time, but even as business owners, I'll talk to business owners that have a really hard time hiring, recruiting, retaining their employees. That's sales man. You got to sell them on your vision, right? I think people that'll come to my sales.

Speaker 2: 1:01:53

I just hired a salesperson recently. The reason why I hired him was because his colleague left the company, a really big company down in Rhode Island. His other person interviewed with me was blown away, and the only reason why he took because he took a position closer to his home, but it made such an impact on him that he told his colleague that was leaving. You got to interview with Green Energy bro Jonathan's just built different, and so that's literally what he came and told me. And when he came and talked with me, we sat down and we talked and he was blown away. And then he was like here's the only thing, man. I got.

Speaker 2: 1:02:29

An interview at this other place happened to be my buddy's company and I'm like, oh man, that's a great company to go to, man, phenomenal. He's actually a really good friend of mine. And he was like don't sell them too hard, I'm not, man, if you end up going there, you're going to thrive. If you come here, you're going to thrive. He goes and interviews over there and that guy's like oh man, jonathan Green Energy, they're amazing. And he's like this is nuts. I've never seen anything like that, right. So he ends up coming and working here, that salesman, and it's really not even sales. I should take that back. It's really not even sales. I should take that back. It's really higher level of communication. That's what it could be and a lot of business owners don't have that. I talked to one guy down south and he was saying oh, I just hired an operations or manager, a general manager, and I said why? He said because I'm not really good at selling my vision down to my team and so you're expecting someone else below you to do that.

Speaker 1: 1:03:27

Never going to work.

Speaker 2: 1:03:28

It's never going to work.

Speaker 1: 1:03:29

Nope, and most business owners, bro, are not. They're not good salespeople, so that's why they hire people in and struggle because they can't. As the leader, you got to be able to show your guys how it's done, and if you can't do that, how do you expect them to follow?

Speaker 2: 1:03:48

Exactly you know they got the 1970s way of 1980s, way of running HVAC companies and talking to people. The case for 30, 40 years ago, right, like, stuff's different now, man. What people care about are different now, and if you're trying to speak a certain way in a home on a sales call that doesn't align with the way people buy today, you're going to have really low numbers. That's what I love about sales you take all the BS out of it. It's just numbers, man. The numbers don't lie Right and it's the same thing as business. Oh, man, you know it's really hard for me to retain employees. I'm like why? Like I don't, I've never had that problem. Like I'm honestly shocked when people tell me they're leaving. I'm like to go where? Like where are you going? You know like OK, and we get a lot of people that come back too because they're just like you know what it wasn't what it is. You know high level of communication, man, that's, if you can communicate a vision that people can believe in, that they can see themselves winning in. And you're doing, you got to follow through with that right you can have, you can retain them through some of the I mean man, being 100% vulnerable and transparent.

Speaker 2: 1:05:14

This first quarter for this year was tough man. We had to lay some people off and we were just slow. It was probably one of the darkest times. I've never had a winter this slow. It was a really mild winter here in New England and it was rough man.

Speaker 2: 1:05:29

And one of the people in particular I had to lay off was someone that's been with me for 10 years. This is his 10 year anniversary and I was like man, like we don't have install jobs. I got to, I got to lay you off. I'm hoping we'll get busy soon. Right, I had zero jobs on the schedule and I just met with him yesterday because he needed to take some time off, in addition, for health reasons, because we've already started ramping back up. He came back yes, he's like listen, man, I'm in, like let's go. And so we ended up laying quite a few people off.

Speaker 2: 1:06:02

Everybody but one person came back and they were like where else am I going to go? Man, like, this is family. You know that's that culture, and culture isn't a bunch of ping pongs and free snacks. You know it's. It's you loving on people, you showing them a vision and then and then proving it. And then not just showing them a vision, but like, what is it that makes Corey tick, that that Corey's interested in, that Corey wants to see? You know, maybe it's him buying a house, and OK, why, why is that so important to you? How do you feel like we can get there? Well, let's see, like, if we maybe put you into this role, do you feel like boom? And then watching guys I mean I've had guys work here that came from doing installation in people's homes that are making over like good six figure salaries, man, and the number one thing that changed was their communication man and they're just like where else am I going to go that I'm going to get that, you know yeah, 100.

Speaker 1: 1:06:57

And as the leader you got to ask, you know you got to be interested. Like, your job as a leader is your employees. That's who you got to say, that's who you got to sell to right, not the customers. The employees have to settle the customers. It's your job to keep the employees happy and if you can't do that, you lose sight of that Then you're going to have people fall off.

Speaker 2: 1:07:20

Yeah, but I agree with what you said, man. I think like that probably would be. I don't know what that looks like, but I think that that would be something I would be interested in the future, cause I, I love what this industry has done for me and, and, uh, anything that I could do to help more people and expand. I'm all about it, man.

Speaker 1: 1:07:40

Well, I think it's something you should really think about, and I don't know if you're a spiritual guy, but you know you should probably. You know, if it's me I would, you know I'd pray about something like that and see what comes up. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:07:50

I love that Because, look, I mean, I know you're doing your thing in the school and that's huge, but I think there's more. I think you can reach more people and I think you should, because it's really, you know, it's really special that you think the way you do and there's just not a lot of it out there. There's a lot of it out there. There's a lot of bs out there. There's a lot of stuff that is not going to move the needle forward for people that they're buying, yeah, and that that you know.

Speaker 2: 1:08:22

That breaks my heart because you know it's just I don't know and I won't get into specifics, but I'm sure you get it oh yeah, I I a lot of hype, a lot of flashiness, that you know, uh, it may work here there, may it may, it may move the needle some, but long-term I don't think so, you know, I think, cause I think at the end of the day, like you know Joe Cressera, I like, I like his, his method with um. He has a class called performance coach class. That's really good for leadership. I honestly think it's funny because his sales training is like what everybody talks about and that his performance coaching class kind of flies under the radar. His performance coach class blew me away, like it literally gave me chills. I only went to the class because I really wanted to learn how to hold my sales team accountable and just be a better salesperson, because for a while I was the only salesperson. Now I have these salespeople under me and I'm like, well, I don't know what to do with them. So I went to this class and it was way more than just a sale Like it way more. My entire leadership team speaks the language from that class now and if they don't, then I'm like go back and watch the videos because you're not following the process. It's the most simplest process but at the end of the day, the point I'm trying to make is it's all revolving around the same thing pure motive. And it's the same thing with sales, and so I've seen a lot of these sales things people are buying into, where they're just lying about. Oh, lennox has this like factory rebate that's out and that's going to end soon. It's like, dude, like you can get sales from that. I'm not going to say you won't, but it's shady as hell. If I was a technician and I worked there, I would have a serious problem with that.

Speaker 2: 1:10:06

One of my favorite things that I love about my culture is I'll give you an example where this happened last week. We were waiting on a delivery for the air treatment stuff that we had, but we had some Remy Halos in the warehouse and so the warehouse manager was just giving Remy Halos to the guys and putting them in. Now I mean, it's still an air purification system, right? My sales manager comes and he's like, hey, man, and, mind you, he's like bonused on, like sales. And so he comes in and he's like, hey man, I don't feel right about what we're doing and I'm like I don't know what he's talking about because I'm not in the day-to-day stuff like that. So I'm like fill me in what's going on. So he told me he's like we're waiting on delivery, but in the interim they're like, hey, just let's throw in these Remy halos, cause we have them. And this is the same thing he's like, but you know, it's not the same thing, like the quality is not the same and all this stuff. And so I'm like most business owners be like yeah, you might win a couple of sales here and there being sleazy, shady, but long term it's going to catch up with you.

Speaker 2: 1:11:21

Man, I tell everybody, whether it's someone coming to work for me or interested in working for me or it's a sale, I got nothing to hide. Look me up, look me up in GPT, look me up on Google, whatever, right, you're not going to find any scandals, anything crazy. I've never been arrested. Company's never been in the news for anything bad. It's been in the news for a lot of great things.

Speaker 2: 1:11:43

I'm like, but at the end of the day, look me up in our reviews, look for my name specifically. See what people have to say about me. Right, there's a lot of power in that, where sometimes I'll even do it for them, like, look here, let me show you. There's my name. There's my name right. I've taught my team to do that because they start getting these amazing reviews. Tom was phenomenal and Tom could be like look at all these places where my name is right. Power in that man You're not going to find. Oh, you know they tried to con me into. In that man You're not going to find. Oh, you know they tried to con me into moving forward because of some Lennox rebate that really didn't exist. So I agree with you, man, it's a referral dude.

Speaker 1: 1:12:20

I mean, if you can show somebody, if I can show a customer that somebody else has said I've done good work multiple times, I don't have to say anything else, like it's 100% of referral, because I'm not sitting there tell you how great I am. I can just show you what other people say. And yeah, dude, it's, it's a game changer for sure. Jonathan man, it's been a great conversation. Dude, I really appreciate you coming on and sharing this information. I don't, you know, I don't often, I don't. I guess I don't have a ton of sales people on that. You know that our mindset's the same and so, yeah, really valuable stuff today. I really appreciate it, my friend.

Speaker 2: 1:13:00

My pleasure, man. This was. This was awesome.

Speaker 1: 1:13:03

Where can people, where would you like people to find you?

Speaker 2: 1:13:31

no-transcript. Listening here I've had people call me. What are we doing, man? Winter sucks and I'm like just listening. You know, just sometimes us business owners are just therapy for each other. You know, we don't have to say nothing.

Speaker 1: 1:13:48

So yeah, sometimes that's what we gotta have, but you gotta be aware to be able to listen when you shouldn't be talking right 100. Well, I appreciate it, my friend. Guys, you should reach out to him. Um, you know, like everything you said today has been spot on. So appreciate you, my friend appreciate you too yes, sir.